Sunday, August 6, 2017

Avalanche of criticism CBC News has obtained a trove of public communications, mostly emails, sent over a 10-day period following the a CBC News story on controversial aspects of C-23, particularly the new powers it would grant to U.S. border agents working on Canadian soil. Letters and emails sent on the issue from Feb. 10 to Feb. 20 comprise 1,527 pages. Only 777 pages have been released to CBC News so far. Names are redacted and, in some cases, so are the towns and provinces the letters and emails came from. Government insiders say the volume of mail received was "unprecedented" and took officials at Public Safety by surprise.

The solution to all of this? Don't go to the USA. Travel Canada and other countries.


http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/pre-clearance-u-s-travellers-bill-c-23-reaction-1.4213797

Ottawa gets an earful on proposed expansion of U.S. border pre-clearance powers

Canada's Senate has yet to approve legislation despite pressure from ambassador

By Evan Dyer, CBC News Posted: Aug 06, 2017 5:00 AM ET Last Updated: Aug 06, 2017 5:00 AM ET
Bill C-23 is aimed at speeding travel to the U.S. by allowing travellers to clear American customs at the point of departure, rather than upon arrival at U.S. destinations.
Bill C-23 is aimed at speeding travel to the U.S. by allowing travellers to clear American customs at the point of departure, rather than upon arrival at U.S. destinations. (CBC)
The Prime Minister's Office received a flood of emails opposing the government's bill to implement new pre-clearance measures at Canadian airports and other departure points following a CBC News story on concerns about the powers the bill grants to U.S. border agents, documents show.
It's been eight months since the U.S. Congress passed its version of a law to implement the latest cross-border agreement with Canada.
The U.S. law authorizes its Customs and Border Protection officials to set up pre-clearance locations at more Canadian locations, allowing Canadian travellers to bypass immigration and customs procedures on arrival at their U.S. destination.
Canada was expected to pass its version of the law around the same time. After all, it was Canada that lobbied hardest for the agreement.
But that hasn't happened.
Canada's ambassador to Washington, David MacNaughton, told the Senate foreign affairs committee he is feeling pressure from U.S. legislators, who keep asking when Canada's legislation will pass.
"Please hurry it up, because I'm a bit embarrassed. I leaned on the Americans so heavily and now they're coming back and saying, 'Where's yours?'" MacNaughton told senators in June.
The bill emerged from the Commons with a thumbs-up, but it has yet to pass the Senate.
One clue to the delays may be found in the prime minister's mailbox.

Avalanche of criticism

CBC News has obtained a trove of public communications, mostly emails, sent over a 10-day period following the a CBC News story on controversial aspects of C-23, particularly the new powers it would grant to U.S. border agents working on Canadian soil.
Letters and emails sent on the issue from Feb. 10 to Feb. 20 comprise 1,527 pages. Only 777 pages have been released to CBC News so far.
Names are redacted and, in some cases, so are the towns and provinces the letters and emails came from.
Government insiders say the volume of mail received was "unprecedented" and took officials at Public Safety by surprise.
U.S. Customs Calgary airport
The Liberal government received an outpouring of reaction to its bill to expand border pre-clearance with the United States following a CBC News story about new powers for U.S. customs officers on Canadian soil. (Todd Korol/Reuters)

• What is pre-clearance?

Pre-clearance allows Canadian visitors to the U.S. to clear U.S. Customs and Immigration while still in Canada at a Canadian port of departure.
Eight Canadian airports offer pre-clearance, two more will do so this year. The Port of Vancouver, Vancouver's train station and some B.C.-Washington ferry routes also offer pre-clearance. Later this year, pre-clearance is expected to be introduced at Montreal's train station for Amtrak's Montreal-New York City route.
The documents show the negative feedback included many missives from people who described themselves as Liberal supporters.
"I have been a dyed-in-the-wool Liberal, but you lose my support if you pass this bill," wrote one person from Burlington, Ont., on Feb. 12.
The same morning, a Coquitlam, B.C., resident warned that after reading about the bill, they now "regretted any financial or political support I've ever given the federal Liberal Party in the past, and have resolved, until I see this one modified to prevent detentions of Canadians or permanent residents, never to support your party again."
"I have voted Liberal all my life but will do evering (sic) to bring this government down if this bill is passed or any version of it," wrote another.

Powers of detention main concern

Most of the letter writers express concern about parts of the bill that grant new powers to U.S. border agents working in Canada. Those include the right to bear arms and, most controversially, the discretionary power to detain Canadians for further questioning if the U.S. agent is unhappy with their answers.
Until now, Canadians passing through U.S. Customs pre-clearance in a Canadian airport have had the right to simply withdraw their request to enter the U.S. if the encounter goes badly, and leave the pre-clearance area.
Section 31 of Canada's legislation takes away that right.
'This is another frightening step to one more impingement of our sovereignty.'— A  British Columbian
"It infringes on our rights as Canadian citizens by allowing a U.S. authority to detain Canadians while on Canadian soil," wrote a British Columbian. "While I am sympathetic to the needs of national security, I find that this is another frightening step to one more impingement of our sovereignty."
"If I try to cross [the border]," wrote another, "and the questioning is heavily weighted on my background, my religion, my personal beliefs about anything, is uncomfortable, or causes me to fear for my own safety, I should be able to unequivocally say, 'You know what? I've changed my mind, I  don't think I want to fly to Atlanta today,' pick up my bags, and leave."
Many writers expressed doubts Canadian border agents would be able to exercise similar powers on U.S. soil.
In fact, the U.S. legislation passed last December does extend the same powers to agents of the Canada Border Services Agency in the U.S. But there are no Canadian pre-clearance facilities at U.S. airports, since it is easier for Canada to screen arrivals at the smaller number of Canadian airports.
Border Facial Recognition
Legislation to expand pre-clearance has passed the U.S. Congress, but it doesn't affect agents of the Canadian Border Services Agency, who don't work at U.S. airports. (Darren Calabrese/Canadian Press)
Among writers worried about how the changes would affect them, some were concerned by the Trump administration's move to impose a version of the Muslim ban Trump promised during the 2016 campaign.
"Given how U.S. citizens and green card holders were turned out based on their religion last month, I don't believe my fears of being detained and questioned are unfounded," wrote a resident of Hamilton, who described themselves as a dual citizen of Canada and the U.S.
A Calgary writer was concerned about interviewing for a visa in order to take a job offer from a company in Florida. "I am terribly afraid that this bill will hurt my chances of potential employment. … The fact that an American border agent can arrest me on Canadian soil for walking away from an interview, which is what this bill would enable, deeply disturbs me!"

Taking heat from both sides

While many letters referenced the Trump administration's perceived hostility to some ethnic and religious groups and called on the Trudeau government to stand up for refugees and Muslims, the pre-clearance bill also came under fire from people on the other side of the spectrum.
One writer emailed Public Safety Minister Ralph Goodale: "I understand the Americans wanting that right, or authority. This would be due in part to Trudeau's plan to bring in thousands of unscreended, so-called refugees to Canada and park them along the U.S. border."
But the writer agreed with others that while "the Americans have the right to protect their country … they don't have the authority nor should they to detain Canadians on Canadian soil. This authority should not even be considered."

  • Alan Graham
I hate Pearson because of this. Last time I flew to the US from Pearson, it took almost 2 hours to get through US Immigration. I almost missed my flight. Now I fly out of Buffalo. The US personnel are the most arrogant obnoxious people. They obviously do not want to be working in Canada.
  • 13 minutes ago
neil carlson
  • neil carlson
I find it most interesting that we have nothing to fear. I walk on water and I never think I'm going to drown.
  • 16 minutes ago
neil carlson
  • neil carlson
@neil carlson frist i must vacuum it off with my spy vacuum cleaner
  • 11 minutes ago
neil carlson
  • neil carlson
@neil carlson its a bird! its a plane! oh its neil on his magic carpet
  • 9 minutes ago
Bob Baker
  • Bob Baker
The perfect solution to all our Border woes lol

http://brickingitforcanada.com/

Need I say more? Ditch C23 now you know it makes sense.
  • 21 minutes ago
Hugh Minet
  • Hugh Minet
Those with nothing to hide have nothing to fear. The Americans are done allowing folks just saunter into the US, whereas Canada is an open border.
  • 43 minutes ago
Paul Smith
  • Paul Smith
@Hugh Minet
 And they won't be allowed to enter legally either.
  • 12 minutes ago
Hugh Minet
  • Hugh Minet
@Duncan Moore

And if such a list existed, folks would find a way to abuse it. Bottom line is the US decides who enters and who doesn’t.
  • 11 minutes ago
Jamie Taylor
  • Jamie Taylor
Are there no Liberal MPs patriotic enough to walk across the floor and end this guy's rule of stupidity?

You will be rewarded come next election. The people of Canada need you to act now.
  • 1 hour ago
neil carlson
  • neil carlson
@neil carlson governor general Space woman
  • 37 minutes ago
manny dafrada
  • manny dafrada
@Jamie Taylor
 CONservatives deny when convenient !
  • 35 minutes ago
Julie Ali
  • Julie Ali
@Jamie Taylor I don't think Mr. Trudeau is stupid. In general folks who put down other folks in this way tend to be less bright than the folks they are putting down.
  • Just now
David James
  • David James
As a white, clean and wealthy Anglo Christian I have no worries about my Nexus account and even less worries about being profiled at the pre-clearance station. Other Canadians need to stop their whining and move along.
  • 1 hour ago
Amy G. Bahned
  • Amy G. Bahned
@David James

And you claim privilege doesn't exist.
  • 1 hour ago
JOHN MCTAGGART
  • JOHN MCTAGGART
@David James

"As a white, clean and wealthy Anglo Christian"

Your attitude and your choice of these words scream pure arrogance.

Nothing more!

Nothing less!
  • 51 minutes ago
David James
  • David James
@Amy G. Bahned

My French wife and me have never thought of ourselves as being privileged; we've just acquired far more wealth and goods than we could have ever asked for thanks to a good education and very wealthy and politically well positioned parents. Yes, indeed, were are so very lucky.
  • 49 minutes ago
Richard Sharp
  • Richard Sharp
@David James

"... white, clean and wealthy Anglo Christian"

You can't get much more racist than that.

."
  • 49 minutes ago
David James
  • David James
@Amy G. Bahned

No, I've never claimed that.
  • 49 minutes ago
David James
  • David James
@JOHN MCTAGGART

It is what it is my friend. As an Old Stock Canadian I've never missed a meal in my life - both as a child and as an adult.
  • 43 minutes ago
Lawrence Howard (LarryRight)
  • Lawrence Howard (LarryRight)
@Richard Sharp
 Why are you claiming the statement is racist?
  • 39 minutes ago
Lawrence Howard (LarryRight)
  • Lawrence Howard (LarryRight)
@JOHN MCTAGGART
 Arrogance?

You should respect your betters.
  • 39 minutes ago
 Sandra Largent
  • Sandra Largent
@Richard Sharp I voted you up Mr. Sharp, first time ever.
  • 38 minutes ago
Vince Le
  • Vince Le
@David James

Wow, Amy says you have privilege.
As a first generation Gen X Canadian with Vietnamese parents who immigrated legally to Canada.
I must have privilege to as I have no problems clearing customs either.
And not one instance of an US Customs Agent pulling his guns and "blamming" me when I enter the US.
  • 37 minutes ago
David James
  • David James
@Richard Sharp

No racism, just a fact of life thanks to my parents and their pedigree as well educated Brits and Scots. As a white, well educated and privileged British-Canadian my life is beyond reproach here in Canada. Never had a problem crossing into the US or traveling abroad either.
  • 37 minutes ago
 Sandra Largent
  • Sandra Largent
@David James Grammar could do with a bit of polishing.
  • 36 minutes ago
manny dafrada
  • manny dafrada
@Vince Le
 You may never know ?.....one (US border officer) could have some sort of grudge from the Vietnam war!
  • 28 minutes ago
Ted Poplaw
  • Ted Poplaw
@David James my, aren't you special...
  • 20 minutes ago
David James
  • David James
@ Sandra Largent

Well Sandra, I just voted you down for the first time ever.
  • 18 minutes ago
David James
  • David James
@ Sandra Largent

And that, my friend, is the best you can muster?
  • 16 minutes ago
JOHN MCTAGGART
  • JOHN MCTAGGART
@David James

I will never be your friend.
  • 15 minutes ago
David James
  • David James
@Vince Le

Me thinks Amy should revisit her position.
  • 15 minutes ago
David James
  • David James
@Ted Poplaw

Yes, I am indeed. Never had a problem ever with the law and have never, ever been profiled.
  • 12 minutes ago
David James
  • David James
@JOHN MCTAGGART

And, my friend, thankfully so.
  • 10 minutes ago
Amy G. Bahned
  • Amy G. Bahned
@David James

Nothing to revisit. Your dismissive attitude of privilege was quite evident. You feel this doesn't affect you so who cares about all the people it will affect. Textbook.
  • 9 minutes ago
David James
  • David James
@Amy G. Bahned

I've never had any reason to think differently.
  • 6 minutes ago
Julie Ali
  • Julie Ali
@Lawrence Howard (LarryRight) I guess it is bristling with pride of being a privileged member of our society and he makes no excuses for his privilege. Would be nice if he went beyond privilege to empathy for others who aren't in his hallowed space in the world. But this is expecting too much I guess.
  • 1 minute ago
Dik Coates
  • Dik Coates
There should be an area that once the 'line is crossed' the traveller is in the US. Until crossing that line, Canadian laws are in effect. Seems pretty simple... The right for guards to be armed and their right to detain should be as established by the individual countries.
  • 1 hour ago
Fritz Kazuba
  • Fritz Kazuba
@Dik Coates
 So you are proposing that the government declare a part of Canada to no longer be Canadian soil? In effect, you are proposing that the government give away a piece of Canadian territory, voluntarily, without the permission of the Canadian people. Good heavens, what an idea!
  • 1 hour ago
Jamie Taylor
  • Jamie Taylor
Justin has made it clear to the world that Canadians are doormats to be walked all over.

He is such a generous guy, giving out our monies, and giving away our rights.
  • 1 hour ago
Jamie Taylor
  • Jamie Taylor
@David James

I did not vote for him.
  • 54 minutes ago
Ted Poplaw
  • Ted Poplaw
@Katy Rose LOL,,,,you are kidding I'm sure
  • 19 minutes ago
Vince Le
  • Vince Le
@Amy G. Bahned

Just for Amy as apparently she missed this Trial video of Khadr constructing IED's

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EQjYowsBgc

And here is Khadr being interrogated. Oh the horrors of it all they brought him hamburgers and offered to get Khadr chocolate bars. Then there was the verbal comments telling Khadr to relax. Then the torture of turning on a fan so Khadr got a nice cool breeze. How could anyone go through such interrogation. And for this Justin give Khadr 10M$... » more
  • 1 hour ago
Vince Le
  • Vince Le
@Vince Le

The post lost this interrogation video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNCyrFV2G_0
  • 1 hour ago
Robert Morris
  • Robert Morris
@Vince Le
 Wrong. The $10M settlement resulted from a Supreme Court decision which established beyond a doubt that Khadr's rights had been violated and that the government of Canada was in part responsble. The liberals have already apologized. The conservatives lack a conscience and therefore are incapable of apologizing. While the video of Khadr constructing IED's is interesting in that it portrays a brainwashed child soldier, it was not considered relevant to the Supreme Court.
  • 1 hour ago
Amy G. Bahned
  • Amy G. Bahned
@Vince Le

Couldn't figure out how to use the reply button ? Or didn't you have the temerity for a direct conversation?

So YouTube videos are now admissible evidence in court?

Try harder.

If a kangaroo military court couldn't even convict him it's pretty clear they had no evidence. That is why the US sent him back. .
  • 1 hour ago
Dik Coates
  • Dik Coates
@Vince Le

and that was only 9 minutes of several years... The interrogators likely work in 8 hour shifts... not Khadr... he was on call day and night.
  • 1 hour ago
Amy G. Bahned
  • Amy G. Bahned
@Vince Le

Also, I won't respond to juvenille attempts to call me out again. Reply to my comments directly or be ignored. This practice is without merit.
  • 1 hour ago
Lawrence Howard (LarryRight)
  • Lawrence Howard (LarryRight)
@Amy G. Bahned
 LOL.
Feeling pretty full of yourself as usual eh?
  • 1 hour ago
Amy G. Bahned
  • Amy G. Bahned
@Lawrence Howard (LarryRight)

Well what am I to think when you guys make a point of attacking me so often?

Clearly I'm in your kitchen.
  • 55 minutes ago
Lawrence Howard (LarryRight)
  • Lawrence Howard (LarryRight)
@Amy G. Bahned
 You're the guy reacting to everything.
  • 51 minutes ago
neil carlson
  • neil carlson
@Robert Morris if it makes anyone feel any better , 50-60% goes to legal fees
  • 45 minutes ago
Amy G. Bahned
  • Amy G. Bahned
@Lawrence Howard (LarryRight)

You're still writing to me Larry

Lol. Still in your kitchen.
  • 44 minutes ago
Richard Sharp
  • Richard Sharp
@Amy G. Bahned

Your kitchen is my kitchen.
  • 42 minutes ago
Lawrence Howard (LarryRight)
  • Lawrence Howard (LarryRight)
@Amy G. Bahned
 Actually, I'm trolling you.

Expertly.

Kinda boring though...too easy.
  • 38 minutes ago
Amy G. Bahned
  • Amy G. Bahned
@Lawrence Howard (LarryRight)

As long as you keep writing back it can be argued I'm trolling you...

But thank you for admitting to being a troll.
  • 31 minutes ago
manny dafrada
  • manny dafrada
@Vince Le
 So soon from the name change Mack MacEven !
  • 26 minutes ago
manny dafrada
  • manny dafrada
@Amy G. Bahned
 Another alias ....Mack MacEven....now called Vince Le
  • 21 minutes ago
Ted Poplaw
  • Ted Poplaw
@Richard Sharp has been awhile, Dick..time to get some overtime?
  • 17 minutes ago
Vince Le
  • Vince Le
@manny dafrada

LOL, just because you have a number of accounts under various names does not mean everyone has. LOL
  • 12 minutes ago
Todd Chomeczko
  • Todd Chomeczko
@Vince Le
 You may not have read the UN Convention on the Rights of the child. It includes the international definition of the child solder. Here's a link :

https://childrenandarmedconflict.un.org/effects-of-conflict/six-grave-violations/child-soldiers/
  • 12 minutes ago
Julie Ali
  • Julie Ali
@Amy G. Bahned Good for you! The big bullies have to gang up to silence anyone with brains. You're doing great.
  • 6 minutes ago
will morgan
  • will morgan
Alt right factless, evidence devoid, logic bereft opinions.
  • 1 hour ago
David James
  • David James
@will morgan

Proper grammar please.
  • 1 hour ago
Dik Coates
  • Dik Coates
@will morgan

???

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